Breaking a puppy point?

[reader4]

As this is my first versatile, I found myself wondering what to do last night when my 3mo-old pup locked onto point at a bush with roosting birds. At first I thought he would just let it pass after some seconds went by, but we've also been working on "whoa" quite a bit and it seemed to just click in. He was rock solid and wouldn't budge. I wasn't quite sure what to do next. Praise for the lack of motion (though I didn't say "whoa")? Call him? I didn't want to call "here" since I wasn't confident he would comply, but gentle coaxing was getting me nowhere. I decided to just pick him up and carry him away until the "spell" was broken. Is this pretty common? Thoughts?

[orhunter]

First, you shouldn't whoa a pup around birds otherwise the dog is following a command and not pointing. True pointing is 100% the dog. I think you did the right thing. An older dog we should be able to call off point (if you want to) but a pup should be left alone when it's doing the right thing. At some point, a pup learns what we hunt and what we leave alone so that sort of thing won't last.

[reader4]

Thanks for the feedback. That was my thinking as well. He was doing the right thing on his own so I gave a little gentle praise and half expected it might distract him, but he just held solid for a couple of minutes. This point was very different than the many sight points on moths, dragonflies, bubble bees, toads, yard flags ... but we did need to get back into the house at some point.

[Drahthaar1108]

I would have flushed the birds and given him a lot of phrase .Forrest

[J D Patrick]

I would have flushed the birds and given him a lot of phrase .Forrest

that was my thought as well,,,

[AverageGuy]

I stay silent while my dogs both young and old work birds or are pointing. Once they are staunch I move in and flush the birds also remaining silent.

With a pup, if possible I loop around and come in from the side vs trying to pass the pup from behind as the latter very much encourages it to break and take out the birds. Whatever the pup does is fine at that age and I keep silent and take in the show. The good ones chase and as long as they are safe I let them. I walk towards the next likely bird cover, the less bold and more cooperative ones will return to me and get in front. The wild ones need some recall to get them back at times and so I do that with those types of pups.

I train the Whoa command away from birds but never use the command around birds until it is used to teach the pup to stand steady to flush, wing, shot and fall. I wait until after the pup's first season of hunting wild birds to do that training. I never utter the word Whoa while my dogs are working birds or pointing birds. They have the nose and need to learn when they have sufficient scent to point staunchly, relocate or move on out of the area after determining there is nothing there.

In the situation you describe I would have stood and observed for quite some time to see if the pup would break. Then I would loop in slowly from the side to flush and see what it had. Let the pup chase the birds when it flies and investigate the scent in the cover. I would stay silent the whole time.

I praise a good bit for adherence with commands and retrieving with puppies and young dogs. Most confident puppies will not need or heed your praise when they find, point and chase birds. Your praise in that specific situation will most likely fall on deaf ears as the pup is overwhelmed with excitement on the scent. I just watch, say nothing and take photos or video if I can.

[Willie T]

I would have watched for a good while. If the pup remained staunch, I would have put the birds up after a while. Being a lefty I prefer to approach pointed birds from the right side. So I would have looped wide right and circled in on the point to flush. I also would make sure the puppy knew I was pleased with what it had done. Like the others said, I would remain silent. The point and bird handling is a dance between the dog and the bird. Good sign of things to come!
Your pup is telling you it is ready for you to put it on more birds by the way.
Willie

[reader4]

Thanks again. I would have liked to flush but they were actually just finches in for the night. It was about 10pm so that didn’t sit well with my ethics I guess. I do view the finches as a step up from pointing moths!

I did watch for maybe 3-4 minutes, including the little pets on his flank. It’s like magic for a first time pointer owner. I read it the same way — need more birds!

[Drahthaar1108]

You need to get you a pigeon loft started, then you will always have birds to work your pup . Forrest

[Expert]

If your dog is pointing finches, say NO BIRD and pull it out of the point. The dog is wasting your time as I have eaten finches when I did 3 months solo survivor conditioning in the desert mountains of NV. I can verify there is not much more meat on them then a crawfish.

I built a slingshot and killed myself a bucket of them but it took way to much energy to cook and clean. So I took to popping the entire bird in my mouth and swallowing.

[Dmog]

Good Lord, he’s back...

[Expert]

I must admit, some of the finest eating on my 3 month walk-a-bout were Round-Tailed Ground Squirrel.

My journey was not all fun and games... I am working on setting up a hunter conditioning program where for a small fee out of shape bird hunters spend 2 - 3 months during the summer in the Nevada mountains.

We supply a jackknife, space blanket, water purifying tablets, and a flint - this is all one needs to survive. I am in negotiations with the Ute Indian tribe and hope to offer Native-American spiritual guides to the more well to do hunters during their journey.