Deutsch Drahthaars VS GSP

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What breed would you rather have for strictly hunting pheasants and why??

Deutsch Drahthaars
15
54%
GSP
13
46%
 
Total votes : 28

Deutsch Drahthaars VS GSP

Postby RoosterBooster » Tue Dec 13, 2005 8:50 pm

What breed would you rather have for strictly hunting pheasants and why??
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Postby DrahtsundBraats » Tue Dec 13, 2005 8:55 pm

Dumb question. I'll take a good pheasant dog-and there are good ones in any number of breeds.
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Postby RoosterBooster » Tue Dec 13, 2005 8:56 pm

DrahtsundBraats wrote:Dumb question. I'll take a good pheasant dog-and there are good ones in any number of breeds.


Why is that a dumb question?? Soon I will be getting a new dog and these are the two breeds I am down to. Just looking for your thoughts not your criticism.
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Postby versdog » Wed Dec 14, 2005 6:56 am

Boy is this a can of worms that got opened or what! IMO I love the Drahthaars Because of the breed tests and requirements for breeding. This makes the chances of getting a dog that looks and does what you want much higher. I still think the breed as a whole is getting better all the time. All I can say is they are hunting machines. They point well and the tracking is unreal. The coats as a whole are much more uniform.
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Postby bill10979 » Wed Dec 14, 2005 9:45 am

Both are fine breeds and used frequently by hunters and preserves/lodges. If all you hunt is Phez, and do so in warmer climate, Id probably opt for a GSP.
Mine trained themselves practically and good, hardy workers.
If you live in colder climate, want to throw in some waterfowl hunting among other things-then Id choose DDs, handsdown. Nod in tracking cripples, goes to ugly dogs too. Nod in ease of training goes to GSP. This is just my opinion. A DD takes a little different touch, is my point, wheras the GSPs mature quicker Ive found on average, and are a "plug n play" out of the box, as a bird dog.
Also, consider a GSP probably kennels better than a DD, and coat is less maintenance-no stripping ever. No big deal but a consideration. Some guys never strip-to each his own. A DD is best as a family dog no question, bonds strongly with owner, moreso than other bird dogs, thrives on attention, is extremely intelligent and driven. In general, a DD hunts for you, GSPs(at least mine) will hunt for anybody as long as theyre hunting.The GSPs in my neck of the woods seem to have only 2 speeds-
All Out and Asleep, whereas the DD is very calm when not working,generally. Ideally, one of each and youre set and can hunt anything, anytime, anywhere!
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Postby Margaret » Wed Dec 14, 2005 6:24 pm

what a bout a Deutsch Springer Pointer?

:D
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Postby mngsp » Wed Dec 14, 2005 7:31 pm

Always a tough decision. The type of terrain hunting the pheasant can make a difference, probably more so between individual dogs than the breed. My GWP is a wonderful dog in tight, small waterways such as Iowa offers, whereas my GSP is too much dog for that cover but excells in the Dakotas.

When a person is north and does late season waterfowling, the DD or GWP is a hands down winner. In dealing with tempature extremes in the field I have to give the edge to the GSP. I have never seen a good GSP quit because he got cold!!! If it's that cold I probably wont be out there myself. Early season hunting or if you choose to test or trial your dog can be in some hot weather. Here I think the GSP has an edge, but I have seen some fuzzy faced individuals that could take heat well though.

If you do your homework, either breed will be a fine hunting companion.
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Valid Comparison

Postby kurzhaar » Thu Dec 15, 2005 3:15 am

If you want a smooth faced dog then get a Deutsch Kurzhaar.

They are tested in the same system and to the same standards and the DD.

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Postby terryg » Thu Dec 15, 2005 12:05 pm

you will probably*(?????) be able to find a better prospect amongst the dk than the general gsp population if you are going purely on who is breeding what. that being said you can count the dk breeders in this country on your fingers.

often these folks want to put a lot of stipulations on what you get and what you will do with it. that is something that doesn't sit well with everyone.

being as few and scattered as they are it may be hard to find one in your area so you can see what their dogs are really doing and how much they, themsleves, really know about dogs as well as seeing the dogs 1st hand.

on the other hand in the general gsp population you will find a lot more of them closer to you but as with any quantity the more their are the more varience you will find.


i recommend you research the individual dogs you can see first hand and then pick the very best you are able that will suit what you think is a good dog.

as was stated, you will find great paheasant dogs in either population so i wouldn't sweat the little stuff like what somebody calls them.
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Postby larue » Thu Dec 15, 2005 7:41 pm

all breeds will produce great pheasant dogs,but they are rare creatures.
Most guys will keep there dogs within gun range,just so they can get a chance at the bumps.
I own one great pheasant dog,he runs hard,has great style,and has the ability to pin a pheasant down,at a great distance.
He tracks,and push's but he seems to know when to stop.
There is no answer to great wild pheasant breeds,it is more about individual dogs, within a breed.
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Re: Deutsch Drahthaars VS GSP

Postby DK1 » Fri Dec 16, 2005 11:04 pm

RoosterBooster wrote:What breed would you rather have for strictly hunting pheasants and why??


Both DD/GSP/DK can and have proven to do fine, neither better than the other for pheasants. That being the case I would choose a GSP or a Deutsch Kurzhaar (I have both DK's and a GSP in my home)- they do better when its hot out and well you don't have to deal with a longer-haired dog. It's easier to keep them cleaner too. The first time I laid my hands on a DD coat, my eyes got wide. A good DD coat is just soo much thicker than a German shorthair. Shorthairs do fine when there's snow on the ground though too. If you're going to be doing lots of cold waterwork get a wirehair of some sort (a DD/Deutsch Drahthaar would be my pick).

One of the biggest things if you want a good dog is you get what you pay for and make sure you do your research on the breeder you buy from.

There are some excellent GSP breeders out there and yes, only a handful of DK breeders in the US. I think genetically, you will find more soundness in the DK than the GSP. There are a few other reasons I like DK's better than a GSP, but that's another thread. And no, not all DK breeders make you test or have strict rules on what you can and can't do with your dog. If you want to participate in the DKV testing system, than yes, you do have certain things you must abide by. Same with the VDD/GNA system if you go with a DD.

mngsp wrote:The type of terrain hunting the pheasant can make a difference, probably more so between individual dogs than the breed.


I think that whether you get a GSP or DK, if you are getting a dog that has been bred to handle field, water, and fur equally, you'll have a dog that will more likely be able to handle whatever terrain you take it to. Because there are some rather various breeding philosophies in the GSP world and dogs that won't hold up to what you take them to. Again, research the breeder you are buying from.

If you are interested in a DK here are some, not all of the DK breeders:
http://www.nadkc.org/pages/kennels.htm

If you are interested in a finding GSP breeder that has been bred to handle field, water, and fur - PM me.
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Phez

Postby bill10979 » Sat Dec 17, 2005 11:27 pm

"they do better when its hot out and well you don't have to deal with a longer-haired dog. It's easier to keep them cleaner too. The first time I laid my hands on a DD coat, my eyes got wide. A good DD coat is just soo much thicker than a German shorthair"

DK-a good DD coat is as practical as it is beautiful and little maintenance. The standard has a wide variance-from about .75 inches to 2 inches. The shorter coated DDs are really nice-there is no clean up, just like a shorthair, yet it is alot more protective in brush and inclement weather. There is a density to it, should have an undercoat, but isnt drastically different. This is a shortcoated DD-again practical and easy to keep.
Some & mine all into this category, are on the longer side-about 1.5 in, I do have more cleanup then a shortcoat-but the flip side is that mine handles cold as well as any dog Ive ever seen, and when I hunt, it is generally pretty cold to brutal depending on the month. Undercoat is extremly thick. I have seen some uglys handle heat well, and run fine. Truth be told, if its that hot out though, Im gone. Early AM or call it, when its hot. Over 70F, thick cover,no breeze, sunny, and humid air just doenst make for a good hunt IMO, unless its dove shootin, and thats easy on the dog,you can rest and water in between retreives.
I do agree with you as far as the breeds generally handling heat better-they do, from my experience. A good GSP is a great dog. I was lucky enough to have a few really good ones. Both breeds are popular with hunters but persoanlly, I havent seen a breed hunt as hard as a DD. They will bust cover like like a bulldozer, be it cattails, or thick field & forest cover. A vest becomes a necessity (for me) and for some.
GSPs are popular for many reasons-they are so easy to train as bird dogs, theyre easy to keep, hardy, cooperative and honest workers generally, fetching is strong enough for most hunters. Hard to go wrong with either, just different strokes. But DDs are fun. Theyre so damn smart, driven, hard and soft at the same time, tracking and retreiving machines and just great companions. Thats why I like em. Like I said, ideally, you have at least one of each.
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Postby RoosterBooster » Sun Dec 18, 2005 12:20 pm

I just wanted to say thanks for all the replies. What great reading!!

You all have only made my decision tougher :D :D

But then again I do agree that both breed can fufill whatever it is I am looking for in a dog. What matters is where I get the dog from and especially what I do with it!!!
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Re: Phez

Postby DK1 » Mon Dec 19, 2005 12:29 am

bill10979 wrote:DK-a good DD coat is as practical as it is beautiful and little maintenance.... The shorter coated DDs are really nice-there is no clean up, just like a shorthair, yet it is alot more protective in brush and inclement weather.....that mine handles cold as well as any dog Ive ever seen.....


I agree, I didn't mean my comment as a negative one. A DD is a wonderful breed to own. And I agree too about hunting if its really hot. I wouldn't be out in 90 degree heat hunting either. Even if the dogs could handle it fine, I couldn't. Do you have much problem with burrs and grass seeds catching in the coat? Cactus? Finding cactus spines around the feet...

bill10979 wrote: I haven't seen a breed hunt as hard as a DD. They will bust cover like like a bulldozer, be it cattails, or thick field & forest cover.


Come hunt over my DK's. :) GSPs are popular, but they aren't DKs. :wink:
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Postby DrahtsundBraats » Mon Dec 19, 2005 10:36 am

I would have to agree about DKs. I have had the chance to train and watch dogs test in Germany, and many are very "high powered" dogs(Only dogs more intense may be the Langhaar-pronounced Lahn'-kar if you want to impress the German's). I know one breeder here in the US that has backed off the DK and has started with DDs because in his years of experience the DK just took longer to get under control and was more difficult to keep BUT that did eventually work at a very high level. I think he felt that they were too often beyond the average owner/trainer's capability.

Without a doubt we see DDs that push the envelope as well, but, overall I would say that the DD is a very good combination of desire/trainability and have seen many first timers do very well with their dogs. I know that many owners go to the DK/GSP feeling that they will get more run or stronger field ability-this is absolute nonsense. I have seen many DD that will put down a good day's work as a big running gun dogs. I saw my DD on point on Sharpies this last season 1-400 yds to the front. I think its more a question of how a dog is trained. One thing I have consistently noticed is that we practically never see DK/GSP in the duck blind or at the motels in duckhunting trucks/rigs.

I am sure that there are different "styles" of dogs in all breeds-it always comes down to the priorities of the breeder. I think if I lived and hunted south of the Mason-Dixon, I would probably have a (calmer) DK in my truck.
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