Training for NA test

Pointing, retrieving, flushing, tracking, behavioral issues, puppy training, etc.

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Re: Training for NA test

Postby SERE Nate » Thu Feb 15, 2018 1:40 pm

JONOV wrote:
GONEHUNTIN' wrote:Keep in mind that most dog's that fail or get low scores in NA do so because of the track.

At a training day this past weekend, a guy mentioned training with a 1/4 or 1/2 hot dog, basically starting with a young pup and dribbling the juice for a track. Does anyone recommend or think this works well?


I've done that and it works great. I just drag it through the snow and he finds it every time
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Re: Training for NA test

Postby AverageGuy » Thu Feb 15, 2018 1:51 pm

SERE Nate wrote:
JONOV wrote:
GONEHUNTIN' wrote:Keep in mind that most dog's that fail or get low scores in NA do so because of the track.

At a training day this past weekend, a guy mentioned training with a 1/4 or 1/2 hot dog, basically starting with a young pup and dribbling the juice for a track. Does anyone recommend or think this works well?


I've done that and it works great. I just drag it through the snow and he finds it every time


Which means you have accomplished about all the positive that comes from that early on approach and likely best to discontinue it and move to other approaches. A 4 month old pup is ready to get on wild game opportunities during frequent walks in natural places, wherever you can make that happen.
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Re: Training for NA test

Postby Bruce Schwartz » Thu Feb 15, 2018 2:25 pm

GONEHUNTIN' wrote:Keep in mind that most dog's that fail or get low scores in NA do so because of the track.


And a pretty lame part of the test as well.
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Re: Training for NA test

Postby AverageGuy » Thu Feb 15, 2018 3:20 pm

Bruce Schwartz wrote:
GONEHUNTIN' wrote:Keep in mind that most dog's that fail or get low scores in NA do so because of the track.


And a pretty lame part of the test as well.

And the reason for that is because the pheasant is healthy and flightless. It leaves hot foot scent only. No wounds to release blood or body fluids like a real wounded bird does. So pup is being taught to track hot foot scent of a healthy bird and if it does it fast enough it will catch it. Never seen that enhance a young pointing dogs pointing ...
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Re: Training for NA test

Postby orhunter » Thu Feb 15, 2018 3:31 pm

Have heard it said, once you know your pup will track, cease training. Lots of good input about how over training can affect the pup in other areas. Griffs are smart, they don't forget. Untraining one will drive a person nuts.
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Re: Training for NA test

Postby GONEHUNTIN' » Thu Feb 15, 2018 6:37 pm

Plus, they start the track in a bare field.
I just hate seeing birds die of natural causes unless I'm that natural cause.
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Re: Training for NA test

Postby SERE Nate » Thu Feb 15, 2018 7:26 pm

I'm taking my gf to a horse ranch for her valentines day gift. We're renting a cabin there. Yesterday I was told that there are hundreds of hungarian partridge in the area we will be staying and they have no issues with me working the dog while we're there. Any tips on how to introduce him to wild birds for the 1st time?
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Re: Training for NA test

Postby GONEHUNTIN' » Thu Feb 15, 2018 7:50 pm

Just turn him loose, keep,your mouth closed, and let him learn.
I just hate seeing birds die of natural causes unless I'm that natural cause.
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Re: Training for NA test

Postby AverageGuy » Thu Feb 15, 2018 7:54 pm

That is a great opportunity. At 4 months I would just walk the pup in the areas where the birds are, stay quiet and observe what goes on. There is not much wrong the pup can do at this stage. Point, chase, track - its all good at this stage, just let the pup get into the encounters as they come and see what it does with little or no direction from you, is what I would do. Carry a camera, you might get some great photo ops.
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Re: Training for NA test

Postby Bruce Schwartz » Thu Feb 15, 2018 8:11 pm

a number of years ago my wife ran one of our griffs in the NA in Montana. We'd trained on pigeons which were the only birds available on the island in Alaska where we lived and were were confident the dog was going to do great. At the test the dog just blew through the field and never recognized the coturnix quail they used as their game bird. Later the judges planted a bird close to the dog and he didn't respond. And still later the pheasant tracking went similarly. It was then that the head judge told my wife that this was the kind of dog she ought to think about getting rid of. He said the dog had a bad nose. She was in tears. Subsequently, he's had four of his pups tested in NA and they all got 112 Pz I.
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Re: Training for NA test

Postby orhunter » Thu Feb 15, 2018 11:23 pm

Bruce brings up a good point. A foreign bird may not get a point. A dog needs a formal introduction as to what we hunt, and what we ignore. When the test starts, judges ask, is there any concern you may have about how your dog will do in the test? I told the judges, my dog has never been around pen raised birds, she may not point them. They then asked, have you hunted her? Told 'em I shot over 200 Chukars over her last season and every one was pointed. They didn't even watch her during her field work and she got 4's they never saw. Every time she pointed something, they were talking and looking somewhere else. Ticked me off.....

That same test. They put down a hen pheasant (track) for the fellow who ran his Griff pup before I ran Ellie. Dog couldn't follow. They decided to run the pup again after I insisted they do so and this time with a rooster. Pup got a 4 as it deserved. Great dog.
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Re: Training for NA test

Postby Bruce Schwartz » Thu Feb 15, 2018 11:53 pm

I think the rules say they must use game birds. I don't think coturnix quail are game birds - maybe in Europe or Japan, but not here
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Re: Training for NA test

Postby JONOV » Fri Feb 16, 2018 10:57 am

Bruce Schwartz wrote:I think the rules say they must use game birds. I don't think coturnix quail are game birds - maybe in Europe or Japan, but not here

Yeah, I thought they were for 4H projects and foodies raising quail eggs and quail for meat...
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Re: Training for NA test

Postby Stretch » Fri Feb 16, 2018 5:03 pm

8F63F3FD-FBCA-4DEE-B3A6-86543119A1C3.jpeg
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Re: Training for NA test

Postby SERE Nate » Fri Feb 16, 2018 5:23 pm

Stretch wrote:
8F63F3FD-FBCA-4DEE-B3A6-86543119A1C3.jpeg


Didn't work on my end.
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