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a person could make a retriever out of a shih-tsu.
AzHusker wrote:but with the success of modern force fetch programs, a person could make a retriever out of a shih-tsu.
AzHusker wrote:How important do you all consider "natural retrieving instincts" to be in a v-dog? How important is "natural retrieving" history of parents in the selection of a good v-pup?
DrahtsundBraats wrote:How do you define natural retrieve??
gwp4me2 wrote:IMHO a v-dog should be a capable retriever out of the box. FF is to polish for passing tests, etc. Especially when birds are involved. When a v-dog sees a bird go down it should naturally have the desire and cooperation to go find it and bring it back. I wish dogs weren't bred who didn't. With FF being so common now we have a chance at losing the natural retrieve in the breeds.
BirdDogger wrote:I agree with gwp4me2. Force fetching only makes the dog pick something up to bring it back. FF does not equate to the increased drive it takes while searching for the downed bird in a thick pile of cattails. The drive has to be there if you want a good waterfowler. Upland hunters can probably deal better with the dog that lacks the desire to retrieve.
My Brittany had plenty of drive to find those birds - and she found them. Problem was that she stood there and pointed 'em. Oh - and she wouldn't get in the water if her fur was on fire, but that was a different problem...both contributed to by my inept training all those years ago.
orhunter wrote:They aren't a versatile if the desire to fetch isn't bred in. A person should be able to create a very good nurtured fetch out of any good dog but many probably don't try because FF is part of their plans down the road. I look at FF as a last resort because I don't want to put my dogs through it. I'm a softie.
...but unfortunately, if that "natural retrieve" is not selected for breeding, it apparently goes away...if the venue doesn't demand it, the breeders have no reason to select for it.
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