Why do you test your dog ?????

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Why do you test your dog ?????

Postby woodboro » Mon Jun 20, 2016 9:13 am

This is a Versatile dogs forum , and some threads have topics that talk about hunting , why they don't test their dogs , and loyal or lack of loyal to dog clubs.

So I thought it would be practical to discuss in the German and European Testing System - why you test your dog.

*I will give you my experience and why:
My first German dog was 28 years ago , and tested in the spring test. (Total failure) had no idea what I was doing , and only advise I was getting was 450 miles away. :lol:
He might of been my best hunting dog , but he was in a 1 dog house hold as well. (I made ton's of mistakes , but what stands out was our system , hunting him and his outstanding hand signal knowledge.
I acquired another dog and ran him thru the ult. test. (I found at that time what the breed was truly about , because of the training) 14 + years he lived , and was the monarch of the household.
He opened the door for me , hunting multiple species , guns, and needless to say fine wines. :D
Bought two more dogs within a year, and ran both dogs through the ult. test , same test... ironically I trained 3 dogs that year. (My training system in place , confirmed I had a system of training for the test system.
Bought another dog a couple years back , and ran him thru the ult. test system. I pushed this dog quite a bite , but was rewarded the first year of hunting with a freezer full of game ,and once again a different personality.
For me the training to test my dogs has gotten me a controlled , obedient hunting dogs. The value I put into my dogs is like the value I put in the guns I carry.
I've hunted since I was 12 years old , but other than a setter as a first dog hunting , The Kurzhaar and DD's have made me into a better hunter over the last 30 years.
Never disappointed coming home from a hunt, the training and testing got me where I like to be. And back the clubs that promote the test systems for it.

What say you __________________
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Re: Why do you test your dog ?????

Postby 3drahthaars » Mon Jun 20, 2016 4:03 pm

Because I believe that:

  • when evaluated fairly and accurately it helps breeders improve on their breeding decisions
  • it can show trends or types coming out of certain kennels, studs, etc.
  • it can force novices to maintain a schedule that will keep them on track to have a serviceable hunting dog by its second season

I don't test my dog for scoresheets ... I've hunted and judged enough to know just what my dog is capable of. I don't need other judges to confirm or deny.



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Re: Why do you test your dog ?????

Postby Kirby » Mon Jun 20, 2016 4:53 pm

I test my dog to impress all the ladies...

Ok I field trialed my labs for my own drive. I like having goals and I like pushing my dogs, this is a good way to work the dog and myself. Its one of the few things in my life I never took as a competition and took it purely as a tool to help me produce a better dog.

My PP (first versatile) is testing for 2 reasons.
1- Same as the lab, give me goals, give me something to aim for, gives me a dead line to aim for so its not just 'some time in the future'.
2- helps the breeder and breed.
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Re: Why do you test your dog ?????

Postby slistoe » Mon Jun 20, 2016 5:13 pm

I have never hunted over dogs that performed as well in the field as when I started to compete with them. It gave added purpose to the training and conditioning and when we hit the field the dogs were in their stride, mentally and physically.
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Re: Why do you test your dog ?????

Postby Misskiwi67 » Mon Jun 20, 2016 7:37 pm

3drahthaars wrote:[*]it can force novices to maintain a schedule that will keep them on track to have a serviceable hunting dog by its second season


^^^ THIS. I've trained a few dogs over the years, but without the testing system and support of the group and breeders, I wouldn't have 1/4 of the development I have out of my dogs. I wouldn't have known what I should be expecting. Vegas is my first hunting dog, testing has been critical for both of us.

I also enjoy the social side, I go to training days to see friends as much as I do to train the dogs.
Vivian II vom Jagdkonig- VJP 71 HZP 191 VGP 262 Prize III
Arabella vom Hoheren Boden- VJP 74 HZP 181/189 VGP 281 Prize I
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Re: Why do you test your dog ?????

Postby woodboro » Tue Jul 12, 2016 8:48 am

192 views and only 4 replies...
Looks like a lot of people are shy on the German / Euro web thread. :lol:
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Re: Why do you test your dog ?????

Postby ryanr » Tue Jul 12, 2016 12:48 pm

+1 on 3Ds reasons.
I'm also a first time DD owner and I ended up with a male that has an enormous amount of drive, much more so than his biddability and quite frankly without my NAVHDA chapter and the steady training partners I've hooked up with in my chapter I'd have likely been lost and at my wits end. Getting together every weekend with these 2 or 3 training partners that are faithfully dedicated to REGULARLY training their dogs has really helped me and my dog to reach our potential as much as we can.

Also, only reason I trained/tested just within NAVHDA is because from a location and time schedule standpoint it just worked out better for me. Regardless, the reasons are the same.
Last edited by ryanr on Wed Jul 13, 2016 11:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Why do you test your dog ?????

Postby ckirsch » Tue Jul 12, 2016 11:07 pm

I test because it results in my dogs being better companions in the fall. I've made a lot of good friends through the testing, have learned a lot, and I've no doubt the dogs enjoy the process as well. I have a UT test coming up next month, so I'm currently out 2-3 times per week working with a dog that would otherwise be sitting in his kennel until mid-September. Obtaining and keeping training birds is a hassle for me, but other than that I enjoy the challenge and the work involved. I also notice that I have a tighter bond with the dogs I've tested than I had in the past, probably the result of all of the additional time I spend with them.
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Re: Why do you test your dog ?????

Postby woodboro » Sat Jul 23, 2016 11:36 am

400 views 7 posts must be a record......

Cat got your tongue :lol:
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Re: Why do you test your dog ?????

Postby ANick » Mon Jul 25, 2016 11:33 am

I't's the journey and the result for me, not so much different as it is a combination of the above posts.

The training group I'm working with is worthy of some hat expanding adjectives. I'm not going to say all are like that. I hope it isn't unique. On that score, I'd recommend the model to any testing organization. A good part of the draw is the use of Facebook (and a part of me is very amazed that I would say that) to keep the conversation and information flowing. It also does nice things for sharing pictures, sketching in lunch plans and even Q&A about dogs. :)

In this day and age, it isn't uncommon for the pup's new home and the breeder being a very long distance apart. It does become ludicrous to expect remote contact to equal first person training experience. However, there are probably enough experienced owners, breeders or judges in a given area to form 'local' groups. 'Local' can be quite variable. I'm a bit over a couple hundred miles to the regular training and I'd go further. So, how many pups are out there of JGV member breeds within a circle on a map with a 250 mile radius, looking for a group? Food for thought.

Sorry about the digression. :)

One other reason to test. This applies in a few cases, I could wish for it to be more common. I've found two breeders, on DL and one DD, that list the performance test results as well the breed show and 'medical' test results of their prior litters. I found this information to be VERY welcome information for anyone shopping for a pup!! It does help the breeder, but if the breeder posts that information, it is also helping the aspiring pup owner.
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Re: Why do you test your dog ?????

Postby 3drahthaars » Mon Jul 25, 2016 12:13 pm

woodboro wrote:400 views 7 posts must be a record......

Cat got your tongue :lol:


I think that you may be trolling.

Really, how many reasons do you think there are beyond what's already been posted except...

... other than it's not PC to say that the reason that one tests one's dog is simply so that one can breed it.

I think that covers it!

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Re: Why do you test your dog ?????

Postby ANick » Mon Jul 25, 2016 6:11 pm

3ds,
It isn't PC?
I don't mean that in a spurious way either.
To me, it's a big point of the 'system', as in, a feature, not a bug.

That said, it doesn't stop someone from breeding their dog. Just controls the paperwork for those pups and some 'interesting times' for the breeder's relationship with the breed club.
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Re: Why do you test your dog ?????

Postby woodboro » Mon Jul 25, 2016 9:03 pm

3drahthaars wrote:Because I believe that:

  • when evaluated fairly and accurately it helps breeders improve on their breeding decisions
  • it can show trends or types coming out of certain kennels, studs, etc.
  • it can force novices to maintain a schedule that will keep them on track to have a serviceable hunting dog by its second season

I don't test my dog for scoresheets ... I've hunted and judged enough to know just what my dog is capable of. I don't need other judges to confirm or deny.



3ds


I guess that covers the thread :lol: /thread
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Re: Why do you test your dog ?????

Postby 3drahthaars » Tue Jul 26, 2016 7:21 pm

ANick wrote:3ds,
It isn't PC?
I don't mean that in a spurious way either.
To me, it's a big point of the 'system', as in, a feature, not a bug.

That said, it doesn't stop someone from breeding their dog. Just controls the paperwork for those pups and some 'interesting times' for the breeder's relationship with the breed club.


The point that I was trying to make is that there are "breeders" who barely hunt their dogs and for them it's only test scores that determine the value of the dogs. The true test of a hunting dog is its performance in the field not 2 or 3 scores from potentially the 2 or 3 best days of its life.

In the old days most of us got into DDs because we were hard hunting guys and wanted a dog that fit our purpose... can't say that is the case these days. I hunt at least 1x per week from September to March plus one more month of preserve season, and that is probably the absolute minimum to do justice for a DD. There's a few breeders that don't even scratch that.

The testing system has been exploited as a marketing tool.

Otherwise, it's back to my original post...

Regards,

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Re: Why do you test your dog ?????

Postby woodboro » Wed Jul 27, 2016 8:24 am

Excluding having a conversation on the internet chat room :
After all people would NEVER learn from that......

Yes the test system is exploited. Yes Breeders have sometimes only scores to determine if they are going to breed to such and such dog.
And yes 26 years ago a Michigan breeder was more interested in my dogs scores than how he hunted.
And yes people don't care what experienced judges say to them , even other judges.

But like the title says "Why do you test your dog" allows individuals to voice their opinion , and give others a reason to possibly test their dog.

I for one use the testing system to gauge where my formal training schedule has done for the dog so the FIRST year I put the dog in the field he is a finished dog.
That is only my opinion, but it has worked for me.

Many Euro/German clubs are getting quite large and their is growing pains , but other clubs are just starting out.
Hopefully they can influence handlers to partake in the testing system, for breeding , training and hunting with a dog with its full potential of tools.
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