Blood Tracking Legislation introduced in Iowa!!

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Re: Blood Tracking Legislation introduced in Iowa!!

Postby Misskiwi67 » Wed Jan 24, 2018 12:56 pm

hicntry wrote:Laws like this are a waste of time. Some of us spend way to much time breaking free range fur dogs off of deer to use them to track wounded deer down. I have killed as many deer as anyone and more than most and have never had the need to track one down. .....just don't take the shot unless you have a clean shot.


I had a shotgun doe this year, shot through the heart, ZERO blood. If I hadn't insisted to the point of a fight that I made a good shot my husband would have given up and a doe less than 75 yds away would have been lost.

You can absolutely make ethical shots and still need help. To do anything less is wasting game and unethical.

I'm going to use my dogs regardless of the law. I can do more with less risk to my future ability to hunt with a law passed.
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Re: Blood Tracking Legislation introduced in Iowa!!

Postby carramrod » Wed Jan 24, 2018 1:06 pm

Last year my brother hit one at a steep angle, arrow went in high and lodged in the offside shoulder. If not for the dog I doubt we would have found the deer that night, and would have lost all the meat due to warm temps. We would have probably found him after a grid search in the light, but doubt we would have stumbled across him that night where he was.

We found 1 drop of blood, and about 80 yards after the shot the deer was dead with a chest full of blood. Mine is broke from chasing deer, he only points them now. I've never had a deer I didn't have to track at least somewhat.
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Re: Blood Tracking Legislation introduced in Iowa!!

Postby JTracyII » Wed Jan 24, 2018 4:30 pm

MissK,

I commend your efforts to get this law passed. This is the first year that it has been legal in my great state of Oklahoma. I (and others) worked very hard to get it passed. I started talking to the folks in charge at the OK Chief of Law Enforcement at the Wildlife Department about 3-4 years ago. He was hesitant about passing it for a couple of years, and retired. I was worried that the groundwork I had laid may be for nothing at that point to only find out that the new Chief was even more open to the idea and had a friend who lived near the border who owned teckels that crossed over to TX to track for folks often. I forwarded the essays I had written that outlined my main arguments for passing it, and suggestions on what to put into the written law so as to make it palatable for all. I got guidance from John Jenneany who is the guru when it comes to tracking dogs and has helped many pass the law in their state. I pushed for looser termspas than what we eventually ended up with but felt getting something passed to start with and maybe loosening it later was better than getting nothing passed at all.

A very similar law was passed here that you all are pursuing. We have to notify by text message, call, etc. to county game warden before starting. Notify, not ask for permissoution. This system has worked well. I assume the game wardens are surprised by the amount of tracking going on and are annoyed by having all of the texts constantly come in. The deer hunters, both gun and bow, here in OK have seemed to greatly benefit from and appreciate that the law passed as a guy started a facebook group that has gained traction called Oklahoma Deer Recovery. If you have a tracking dog and want to help folks you can sign up and you will be put on the map as a tracker in the county you live in. Hunters have learned about this and are calling trackers all over the state to get help finding their wounded deer. Folks are posting all kinds of pictures and distances tracked, and people are using all kinds of dogs. Very interesting to read. If you get this passed you might see if someone wants to take on managing a similar account/page. You will get more tracking opportunities than you want this way. Here is the article about passing it in OK if interested....http://newsok.com/article/5531291
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Re: Blood Tracking Legislation introduced in Iowa!!

Postby carramrod » Wed Jan 24, 2018 5:47 pm

I was curious and looked it up, and apparently KS does allow it now as well. It's written very similar to the one originally posted, except you can carry the gun or bow, but only during shooting hours. At least it's allowed.
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Re: Blood Tracking Legislation introduced in Iowa!!

Postby Bigearl » Wed Jan 24, 2018 9:41 pm

Misskiwi67 wrote:Because currently, dogs are not allowed to pursue large game. I use my dogs on occasion with the hope that if I were ever caught, I could argue I was recovering game, not pursuing it.

That's one helluva grey area.

Why would EXPANSION of the use of dogs in hunting make you worried about your hounds???

Because it's not an EXPANSION. It's quite the opposite. Any time you agree to restrictions it only leads to more(most times any ways).
Let's say it's now legal in Iowa to track wounded deer with a leash, but illegal to push/run deer with dogs.
Tomorrow night in Iowa I'm coon hunting with a 6 month old pup treeing walker, who is obviously off leash, and she bumps and chases a deer for mile because she's not broke yet. The warden sees this happen and now I have a fine for pursuing deer "off leash". We all know that clearly wasn't the case but I'm still subject to the fine. You may be gaining ground in one area but it's at the expense of other types of hunters.
NEVER vote for restrictions like leash laws of any kind. That's my personal philosophy any ways.
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Re: Blood Tracking Legislation introduced in Iowa!!

Postby carramrod » Wed Jan 24, 2018 9:47 pm

Bigearl wrote:
Misskiwi67 wrote:Because currently, dogs are not allowed to pursue large game. I use my dogs on occasion with the hope that if I were ever caught, I could argue I was recovering game, not pursuing it.

That's one helluva grey area.

Why would EXPANSION of the use of dogs in hunting make you worried about your hounds???

Because it's not an EXPANSION. It's quite the opposite. Any time you agree to restrictions it only leads to more(most times any ways).
Let's say it's now legal in Iowa to track wounded deer with a leash, but illegal to push/run deer with dogs.
Tomorrow night in Iowa I'm coon hunting with a 6 month old pup treeing walker, who is obviously off leash, and she bumps and chases a deer for mile because she's not broke yet. The warden sees this happen and now I have a fine for pursuing deer "off leash". We all know that clearly wasn't the case but I'm still subject to the fine. You may be gaining ground in one area but it's at the expense of other types of hunters.
NEVER vote for restrictions like leash laws of any kind. That's my personal philosophy any ways.


You'd probably also have a citation for using too small of caliber gun since .22 is illegal for use in some states for deer, hunting outside of legal shooting hours, and, depending on if you have a deer tag or not, hunting without a license.
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Re: Blood Tracking Legislation introduced in Iowa!!

Postby Bigearl » Wed Jan 24, 2018 9:56 pm

And in most states small game seasons, like coon, run longer than deer. Now we have the possibility of hunting deer out of season. You may laugh but I've seen people get fined for silly crap like this before.
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Re: Blood Tracking Legislation introduced in Iowa!!

Postby Misskiwi67 » Thu Jan 25, 2018 10:14 am

Pursuing deer with dogs is already illegal. What is preventing that citation from happening today??

Honestly curious, I want to know as many arguments for and against so so can go in prepared, or even try to get it changed while it's in committee.
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Re: Blood Tracking Legislation introduced in Iowa!!

Postby JTracyII » Thu Jan 25, 2018 10:59 am

carramrod wrote:
Bigearl wrote:
Misskiwi67 wrote:Because currently, dogs are not allowed to pursue large game. I use my dogs on occasion with the hope that if I were ever caught, I could argue I was recovering game, not pursuing it.

That's one helluva grey area.

Why would EXPANSION of the use of dogs in hunting make you worried about your hounds???

Because it's not an EXPANSION. It's quite the opposite. Any time you agree to restrictions it only leads to more(most times any ways).
Let's say it's now legal in Iowa to track wounded deer with a leash, but illegal to push/run deer with dogs.
Tomorrow night in Iowa I'm coon hunting with a 6 month old pup treeing walker, who is obviously off leash, and she bumps and chases a deer for mile because she's not broke yet. The warden sees this happen and now I have a fine for pursuing deer "off leash". We all know that clearly wasn't the case but I'm still subject to the fine. You may be gaining ground in one area but it's at the expense of other types of hunters.
NEVER vote for restrictions like leash laws of any kind. That's my personal philosophy any ways.


You'd probably also have a citation for using too small of caliber gun since .22 is illegal for use in some states for deer, hunting outside of legal shooting hours, and, depending on if you have a deer tag or not, hunting without a license.


So far I have not heard of any issues in OK with the things you folks are worried about. A similar law has passed in many states and it seems to be no problem. I agree that I would prefer to not have to have a leash and would prefer to carry means of taking, but allowing folks to harvest their wounded deer is important and an ethical matter. There is a balance that must be struck to get things to move forward sometimes.
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Re: Blood Tracking Legislation introduced in Iowa!!

Postby Bigearl » Thu Jan 25, 2018 12:14 pm

Misskiwi67 wrote:Pursuing deer with dogs is already illegal. What is preventing that citation from happening today??

Honestly curious, I want to know as many arguments for and against so so can go in prepared, or even try to get it changed while it's in committee.

Different angle here.
Officer discretion is probably the reason my above hypothetical situation wouldn't result in a citation. Now if a warden can tell the difference between a coon hunter who's dog bumped, and chased a deer, and a deer hunter running deer with dogs. Then could we presume that same warden can tell the difference between a deer hunter running deer with dogs, and a deer hunter tracking a wounded deer with one dog?

I don't live there and have no experience with your DNR officers, but under your current law, I wouldn't hesitate to track a wounded animal with my dog off leash. Gun in hand and the whole nine. If a game warden rights you a ticket for such under your current law then shame on him/her.
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Re: Blood Tracking Legislation introduced in Iowa!!

Postby orhunter » Thu Jan 25, 2018 12:41 pm

I’m on your side Bigearl.
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Re: Blood Tracking Legislation introduced in Iowa!!

Postby Misskiwi67 » Thu Jan 25, 2018 2:07 pm

I do track dogs currently. But I have to pick and choose wisely. I don't track on public land, I don't advertise, and can't start a trained tracking dog network.

Just because I can get away with it now doesn't mean it wouldn't be better (for me) to have the option to do more.
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