Water Test?

AKC, CKC, KC, ANKC, UKC, ENZI, etc. testing.

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Water Test?

Postby parshal » Wed Jul 06, 2005 9:46 am

I heard someone mention that AKC hunt tests will begin including water now? I'd heard quite some time ago about the GWP's having a water retrieve but this was stated that it would be for all pointing breeds. Can someone confirm that this is true and, if so, what sort of water test is it?
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Postby dualgwp » Wed Jul 06, 2005 9:59 am

AS far as I am aware, only GWP's need to pass a water test in order to complete a Senior or Master title.
Havn't heard anything else concerning any other breeds.
The Del Val GWP club will be holding a water test Aug. 21 at Colliers Mills in NJ. Anyone interested.... contact gbw19044@aol.com
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Postby parshal » Fri Jul 08, 2005 2:12 pm

OK, I found it (http://www.cgspc.org/watertest.htm). It looks like they will have three different levels of water retrieving titles separate from the hunt test titles. The last one isn't a gimme.

Novice Retrieving Dog (NRD): Dog is required to retrieve a single dead bird in the water with a minimum swim of 20 yards; a shot will be fired. At judges' discretion, a bird drifting more than 40 yards from shore may be declared "out of bounds," and be re-thrown.

Retrieving Dog (RD): The dog is required to retrieve a wide-spaced (approximately 60 degrees angle) double through eight (8) decoys, with the falls being at distances of approximately 50 yards on the first fall through decoy, and 20 yards on the second fall.

Retrieving Dog Excellent (RDX): Requirements for dogs competing for RDX shall be as follows:
1. The dog shall give a finished performance, showing both class and style while competing for this title.
a. Dog will be brought to and into circle off leash and under control.
b. Handler may elect to have dog stand, sit or be downed, but the original position must be
maintained for each individual series.
c. A reasonable move of the dog to mark the fall of a bird is acceptable, but no other
movement by the dog is allowed. Controlled break is not allowed.
d. No dog may be sent to retrieve until the last bird has hit the ground/water and handler
has been directed to send dog by judges.
e. Dog must enter water immediately with eagerness.
1. Water Retrieve
a. Dog is required to retrieve to hand, a triple, first fall to be at 40 yards to one side, second fall to be a minimum of 60 yards through decoys, third fall to be 20 yards landing to opposite side as the first fall.
Example: First fall, 40 yards to right; second fall, 60 yards through decoys; third fall, 20 yards to left, (see diagram)
b. Decoys (8) to be placed between 30 yards and 60 yards in water
c. Dog must enter and reenter water without hesitation. Delays to be penalized, and excessive
delays disqualified.
2. Blind Water Retrieve
a. The dog is required to be brought to the line without seeing fall. Handler is to be advised
of location of bird.
b. Dog is required to retrieve, to hand, at a range of approximately 50 yards, through eight
(8) decoys.
c. No shot will be fired for this test.
d. To be completed after triple water retrieve.
e. Dog must enter and reenter water without hesitation. Delays to be penalized, and excessive delays disqualified.

Disqualifications
1. Lack of absolute steadiness on the line.
2. Hardmouthing (both Judges must declare the bird unfit).
3. Handler must not move from the circle.
4. Excessive delay entering or reentering the water over two (2) minutes.
5. Handler cannot touch dog except tap to release.
6. Loses interest, wanders around aimlessly, or up and down water edge.
7. Refuse handler commands to handle, over four (4) times.
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Postby Tony » Fri Jul 08, 2005 5:22 pm

Parshal,

This is not the AKC water test that the GWP's must pass for their SH, MH, FC, or AFC. I have never heard of the NRD, RD, or RDX titles before.
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Postby dualgwp » Fri Jul 08, 2005 7:44 pm

what was posted is a test for Weims.
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Postby Mn John » Fri Jul 08, 2005 10:39 pm

Yes what was posted by Parshal is the water portionof the Weimaraner Ratings Test. There is a land portion that must also be successfully complete to earn the ratings.

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Postby mngsp » Thu Jul 14, 2005 6:58 am

The water test mentioned by parshal while very much like the Wiem ratings test is a retrieving test by the GSPCA. These tests are held by local member clubs, sometimes in conjunction with an AKC HT. The tests are open to GSPCA members only.

I like the test and hope it becomes more widly offered. The only beef I have is having to be a GSPCA member to enter. I am a member but think that the participation would be much higher if not for this requirement. I have the complete rules from the GSPCA if anyone is interested.
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Postby Raydar » Thu Jul 14, 2005 12:51 pm

mngsp
I looked on the gspca website and did not see any mention of this test. Is it a gspaca sanctioned event or just done by member clubs? How would someone find out which member clubs run the test?
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Postby mngsp » Thu Jul 14, 2005 1:39 pm

Raydar, that's why the test is so well recognized due to the organization and promotion by the GSPCA.

There is to my knowledge no centralized schedule of these tests. It is a GSPCA event done my member clubs.

Here is the rules I recieved from Dean Browning last year when our club tried to organize one in conjunction with our Fall Hunt Test. Ultimately we had to cancel it due to lack of swimmable water. But the amazing thing is that a fly sheet for it was sent out along with our HT premium to over three hundred people and we had about 1/2 dozen dogs entered at max. The RD and RDX titles are some pretty nice titles, but I fear NRD will become just like the JH title is becoming.... a way for show dogs to be "field titled" and not a way to get new people involved and advancing to higher levels of testing.

Here are the rules......

GERMAN SHORTHAIRED POINTER CLUB OF AMERICA
WATER TEST RATING STANDARDS

SECTION 1
The following Ratings are offered by the German Shorthaired Pointer Club of America to it's members to enable owners of German Shorthaired Pointers showing the ability in the following activities permanently in conjunction with the dog's name.
Any dog earning a Rating will be issued the appropriate Certificate by the Secretary and signed by an Officer of the Club.
SECTION II
The Ratings offered by the German Shorthaired Pointer Club of America are the following:
Novice Retrieving Dog NRD
Retrieving Dog RD
Retrieving Dog Excellent RDX

SECTION III
Eligibility of Dogs
A. Any German Shorthaired Pointer with an individual AKC number, an AKC "Limited Registration" and/or an ILP number who has obtained the age of six (6) months on the first advertised day of the tests may compete for any or all of the ratings offered.
B. Ratings Tests are open to all German Shorthaired Pointers whose owners and co-owners are members of the German Shorthaired Pointer Club of America.
C. Spayed bitches or neutered males may compete for and receive ratings.

SECTION IV
Eligibility of Club and Procedure
A. Any AKC recognized German Shorthaired Pointer Club recognized by and registered with the German
Shorthaired Pointer Club of America shall be eligible to conduct rating tests provided that the club
complies fully with all portions of these rating standards. All tests shall be witnessed by a GSPCA
representative. The GSPCA reserves the right to appoint a representative of their choice to observe any
test sponsored by any club.
1. It shall be the responsibility of the GSPCA representative to review all rules with the judges and
rating test Committee to be sure that all points are fully understood, prior to the test.
2. It is the duty of the GSPCA representative to assure that the test is conducted in accordance with
the rules. The rating test chairperson of the sponsoring club shall be responsible to the GSPCA
representative.
3. All Result forms both pass and fail, must be returned to the GSPCA Water Test Administrator
and the local club shall retain second copy completely and correctly filled out. A $3.00 per entry
fee to the GSPCA will be required from local clubs sponsoring rating tests. This will go to the
general fund to defray the expenses associated with sponsoring the rating test program. This
donation must be received before result forms can be processed.
B. Requirements
1. Ratings chairperson and secretary must be members of the GSPCA.
2. The rating secretary of each GSP Club desiring to conduct such Rating Tests shall make a written request to the GSPCA Water Test Administrator on official forms supplied by him/her.
3. Each request will be postmarked a minimum of thirty (30) days prior to the first day of the proposed tests.
4. The local club shall recommend one or more individuals to represent the GSPCA for the purpose of witnessing the tests.
5. Two judges are required and shall be selected by the local club rating test committee; and shall be in good standing with the AKC. Judges starting a stake must judge all dogs in that stake. It is highly desirable that both judges be persons experienced with our breed, and our rating tests



Page 2

program. However, when impossible to arrange, the committee should be sure that at least one of
the judges had these qualifications.

Sponsoring club members may judge a rating test for their club only if they have previously
judged GSPCA rating tests and/or AKC field trials and/or AKC hunting tests, or at least one
judge must qualify as above. Neither judge, nor any member of their immediate family nor any
person living in the same household may either own or coown any dog for which he/she will act
as judge.
6. Any change in judging from the original application requires notification to the National Office.
7. Each request shall include:
a. Date or Dates with the starting time of first event.
b. Exact location
c. Names of judges and brief qualifications.
d. Types of birds to be used.
e. Names of club rating test chairperson, rating test secretary, and GSPCA representative.
8. No dog is permitted to practice on the rating test grounds on the day of the rating test.
9. No dog may be judged for a rating while under judgement in a field trial. They may be judged for a rating at the same trial.
C. Protests, appeals, mis-tests
The sponsoring club's rating test committee and GSPCA representative shall have the authority to decide upon any problems arising during the testing time. These decisions must be made in accordance with these GSPCA Ratings Standards most current revision.
In the case of mis-tests, the dog shall be passed over, and brought up to be retested later the same day.
SECTION V- Retrieving ratings
A. Requirements for retrieving dog tests.
1. Recognized game birds, ducks, or pigeons must be used for the NRD, RD, RDX tests. Whichever
Is selected must be used throughout the stake for all dogs entered in that stake. A freshly killed bird shall be used for each NRD entrant.
2. Dead or shackled birds may be used for the RD and RDX test. But at least one live bird per dog
must be shot in each test. Dead bird required for NRD.
3. At each station where a live bird is shot the bird thrower should be backed by at least two gunners.
The judges are to arrange the gunners stations depending on the test. On double or triple retrieves,
the birds are to be dropped from separate stations.
4. Novice dogs may be worked upwind. In RD or RDX stakes dogs should be worked across or
downwind to show ability to work and hunt.
5. If, in a judges' discretion, a bird is declared to be out of bounds, the dog should be passed over
and another dog run before the former dog returns for judgment. Bird can float out of bounds only
one (1) time due to drifting and dog not entering the water to complete the retrieve in all tests.
6. Handling is permissible in all tests, but overhandling either voice or whistle, shall be penalized at
the judges' discretion.
7. If on a water retrieve the dog reduces the time required to complete the retrieve by the intelligent
use of land, he shall not be penalized. Use of land for the mere purpose of avoiding water will be
penalized.
8. Calibers of gun used in all tests shall be .20 gauge or larger shotguns or .22 caliber blank cartridges (.22 caliber crimp not allowed.) A blank gun may be used solely in the NRD test.
However, at least one shotgun must be fired in the RD and RDX tests.
9. Objects may not be thrown to encourage a dog to enter water or to direct dog. This is a
disqualification in any stake.
10. All shots to be fired AFTER bird is released or thrown and in the air in all retrieving tests.







Page 3

NRD- Novice Retrieving Dog
A. Requirements for dogs competing for NRD's shall be as follows:
1. Water Retrieve
a. Dog is required to retrieve a single dead bird in the water with a minimum swim of 20 yards, a shot will be fired. At judges' discretion, a bird drifting more than 40 yards from shore may be declared "out of bounds," and be re-thrown. See #6 above.
B. Scoring- All scoring is on a pass/fail basis according to the official result forms.
C. Procedures


1. A circle of rope, hose, or other material is to be laid out with a radius of six (6') feet (12' diameter) clearly defining boundaries, circle must come no closer than three feet (3') from water's edge. Handler must remain within the circle until the retrieve is completed. Dog must deliver bird to circle.
2. No dog may be sent to retrieve until the bird has hit the water and handler has been directed to send dog by judges.
3. Steadiness on line is not required, and dog may be restrained by: 1) holding dog; 2) holding collar; 3) both 1 and 2; and 4) leashing dog.
4. Disqualifications
a. Hardmouthing (both judges must declare the bird unfit)
b. Excessive delay of over two(2) minutes to enter water.
c. Loses interest, wanders around aimlessly, or up and down waters edge.
d. Refuses handlers commands to handle, over six(6) times.


NRD - WATER


- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 40 yards maximum - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -


- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 20 yards minimum - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -





Handlers circle, 6 ft. radius
(12 ft. diameter)
"3 ft. from edge of handler's circle to waters edge.



RD- Retrieving Dog
A. Requirements for dogs competing for RD shall be as follows:
1. Water Retrieve
a. The dog is required to retrieve a wide-spaced (approximately 60 degrees angel) double through eight (8) decoys, with the falls being at distances of approximately 50 yards on the first fall through decoy, and 20 yards on the second fall.
b. Dog must enter water promptly.
B. Scoring- All scoring is on a pass/fail basis according to the official result forms.


Page 4

C. Procedures
1. A circle of rope, hose, or other material is to be laid out with a radius of six (6') feet (12' diameter) clearly defining boundaries. Circle must come no closer than three feet (3') from water's edge. Handler must remain within the circle until all the retrieves are completed.
Dog MUST retrieve TO HAND.
2. No dog may be sent to retrieve until the last bird has hit the ground/water and the handler has been directed to send dog by judges.
3. The dog shall be steady on the line (controlled break allowed). Touch to release permitted, but restraint not permitted. Controlled break allowed means "Voice and/or hand signal may be used to stop dog, however, dog must have all four feet inside the circle to be defined as being under control."
4. Disqualifications
a. Hardmouthing (both Judges must declare bird as unfit.)
b. Excessive delay of over two (2) minutes to enter or reenter the water.
c. Loses interest, wanders around aimlessly, or up and down water edge.
d. Refuses handler commands to handler, over five (5) times.
e. Performance so bad, judge would not take hunting.


RD - WATER
(Ist Bird 50 yards)




(2nd bird 20 yards)


Handlers circle, 6 ft. radius (12 ft. diameter)
3 ft. from edge of handler's circle to water's edge.


RDX- Retrieving Dog Excellent
A. Requirements for dogs competing for RDX shall be as follows:
1. The dog shall give a finished performance, showing both class and style while competing for this title.
a. Dog will be brought to and into circle off leash and under control.
b. Handler may elect to have dog stand, sit or be downed, but the original position must be
maintained for each individual series.
c. A reasonable move of the dog to mark the fall of a bird is acceptable, but no other
movement by the dog is allowed. Controlled break is not allowed.
d. No dog may be sent to retrieve until the last bird has hit the ground/water and handler
has been directed to send dog by judges.
e. Dog must enter water immediately with eagerness.
1. Water Retrieve
a. Dog is required to retrieve to hand, a triple, first fall to be at 40 yards to one side, second fall to be a minimum of 60 yards through decoys, third fall to be 20 yards landing to opposite side as the first fall.
Example: First fall, 40 yards to right; second fall, 60 yards through decoys; third fall, 20 yards to left, (see diagram)
b. Decoys (8) to be placed between 30 yards and 60 yards in water (see diagram).


Page 5
c. Dog must enter and reenter water without hesitation. Delays to be penalized, and excessive
delays disqualified.
2. Blind Water Retrieve
a. The dog is required to be brought to the line without seeing fall. Handler is to be advised
of location of bird.
b. Dog is required to retrieve, to hand, at a range of approximately 50 yards, through eight
(8) decoys.
c. No shot will be fired for this test.
d. To be completed after triple water retrieve.
e. Dog must enter and reenter water without hesitation. Delays to be penalized, and excessive delays disqualified.
B. Scoring- All scoring is on a pass/fail basis according to the official result forms.
C. Disqualifications
1. Lack of absolute steadiness on the line.
2. Hardmouthing (both Judges must declare the bird unfit).
3. Handler must not move from the circle.
4. Excessive delay entering or reentering the water over two (2) minutes.
5. Handler cannot touch dog except tap to release.
6. Loses interest, wanders around aimlessly, or up and down water edge.
7. Refuse handler commands to handle, over four (4) times.

RDX - WATER

(2ND Bird, 60 yards)

decoys

decoys (1st Bird, 40 yards)


(3rd Bird, 20 yards)

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - shore

Handlers circle, 6 ft. radius (12 ft. diameter)
3 ft. from edge of handler's circle to water's edge.

RDX - BLIND

_________(Bird)________
50 yards

decoy decoy
decoy
decoy decoy
decoy
decoy decoy



- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -shore


Handlers circle, 6 ft. radius (12 ft. diameter)
3 ft. from edge of handler's circle to water's edge.
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Postby Raydar » Thu Jul 14, 2005 3:21 pm

mngsp
I sent an email to someone I know in a local GSPCA chapter to see if they run the test. I have run NAVHDA tests and while I do like the overall format I can see where this GSPCA water test puts more focus on marking ability which would suit me a bit better as I actually hunt my GSP more on waterfowl than upland birds.
I found this judging criteria kind of amusing
"Performance so bad, judge would not take hunting"
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GSPCA Water Test, Can't find one to enter...

Postby gsp2west » Fri Jun 02, 2006 4:17 pm

Does anyone know of a scheduled GSPCA water test in the western part of the US ?? OR know where I may look to find one. Eveyone I've contacted so far says they don't know of any scheduled and the GSPCA says the test has not been accepted very well....
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Postby Hunters Edge » Sat Dec 16, 2006 12:28 am

From Colorado it is a little hike but I believe they have had a WATER TEST for the last three years, the GSPC of Michigan. I am not sure but believe the web site is http://www.gspcofmi.org

Anyone in the surrounding area they usually run it in July. The grounds they use are at Highland Recreation area in Highland or Milford MI. This time is reserved and they usually run the Wiem and the GSP test together and afterwards the GSP club has their annual picnic everyone brings a dish to pass and afterwards they use the field trial grounds for training.

Any way I hope other clubs start offering the test and in time I believe it will catch on. I think the reason it does'nt at this time is AKC does not recognize it once those titles are able to be put on pedigree's and go down in history I believe you will see that everyone would be trying to achieve it well a lot more than right now.

I believe they were the first or one of the first to run the test. That year there was a lot of entries and many failed, they found out its not as easy as it may apear, since then the entries are not as many but the qualifers I believe are more frequent or more of them percentage wise.

So anyone in the area or even out of the area that would like to run the test and willing to travel plan on coming to Michigan in July. Ohh don't forget to bring a plate to pass there is plenty of food, fun and dogs.
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Postby larue » Sun Dec 17, 2006 6:10 am

I have considered holding a water test with our fall walking trial,we have the water for at least the first two levels.It would be a true test though,no 70 degree water in nov in wis.
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Postby CherrystoneWeims » Sun Dec 17, 2006 11:01 pm

The GWP Club will recognize a retrieving test from a Weimaraner Club or a GWP Club.
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Postby mngsp » Mon Dec 18, 2006 7:31 am

The GWP Club will recognize a retrieving test from a Weimaraner Club or a GWP Club.


Does that just cover the standard AKC type water test or does that inlcude The WCA Retriever Ratings tests such as NRD, RD, and RDX?



Larue

Man have it your place in summer in conjunction with a bbq or picnic and that would be perfect.
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