Reloaders?

[mikehoncho]

Oh yea, dealt with a few smart asses that frequent this site. What a great trip!

hey, i resemble that!

The effective range of a 28 is probably around 35 yards at most. I really don't know.

i saw this guy in SD this season DROPPING birds with a 28ga at 50 yards routinely. it made me sick. i guess it helps to hunt for 2 straight months huh?


now, on topic, how do different wads affect pattern and string? could you check your string by paper patterning while swinging? not sure how effective it would be and you'd need a hell of a lot of paper but a longer string should show up on paper so long as you maintain your swing.

[orhunter]

I know some guy back in the stone age would put long pieces of paper on the side of a trailer and shoot it as it went by. I don't remember if the gun was stationary of if it was swung with the speed of the trailer. A stationary gun will show the true length of the string but I would think swinging the gun would shorten the string in relation to the target. Remember, shot string is relative to the speed of the target. Although the string exists under all conditions, it is meaningless on stationary and slow moving targets.

I don't know what the effect wads have on the string but they sure do affect pattern especially at ultra high velocities.

Hummmm.... The 28 at 50 yds. That's some pretty slick shooting. I should take lessons...... The length of the string at 35 yards is much shorter than 50 yards.

Longest shot I ever made on a rooster was about 70 yards with one of those hot .410 loads, 3/4 oz of 7 1/2's. One BB, in one eye and out the other..... Didn't kill him but a blind bird doesn't fly very far.....

[Fraz]

i saw this guy in SD this season DROPPING birds with a 28ga at 50 yards routinely.

There's only 2 guys I know that achieve that feat and I'm most definately not one of them. I sure don't resemble that remark as my stats clearly show.
Yes i'm anal, I kept stats of all my shots, misses, and other worthless imformation. I did make a couple nice shots with the broomstick and I did shoot the 28 gauge better than the 12. However, I only recommend shooting 12 gauge Federal Pheasants Forever 1 1/4 oz. copper plated 5 1550 fps. Deadly!

how do different wads affect pattern and string? could you check your string by paper patterning while swinging? not sure how effective it would be and you'd need a hell of a lot of paper but a longer string should show up on paper so long as you maintain your swing.

Wads might have an impact as would buffering.
High speed photography can capture shot string. There was a Discovery show on recording shot string. Sorry can't remember the name. Great show.
The primary reason I brought this up is because 28 gauges tend to have a relatively short shot string.
I'm was hoping for a tip or two on 28 gauge loads. I have no doubt I will be able to reload them for much less than Gander's price.

Longest shot I ever made on a rooster was about 70 yards with one of those hot .410 loads, 3/4 oz of 7 1/2's. One BB, in one eye and out the other..... Didn't kill him but a blind bird doesn't fly very far

Very nice!

When I start loading 28 ga, my pheasant shells will have size 7 shot in them.

Here's my starting point for pheasant loads -
STS hull - rem 209 primer - rem PT28 wad - blue dot powder - 3/4 oz. copper 5 - 1268 fps ( I can't find any formulas much faster)
I was hoping for 1350 - 1380 fps range.

[ChuckDC]

I know some guy back in the stone age would put long pieces of paper on the side of a trailer and shoot it as it went by. I don't remember if the gun was stationary of if it was swung with the speed of the trailer. A stationary gun will show the true length of the string but I would think swinging the gun would shorten the string in relation to the target. Remember, shot string is relative to the speed of the target. Although the string exists under all conditions, it is meaningless on stationary and slow moving targets.

That was Bob Brister. He details the testing in "Shotgunning, the Art and the Science". Interesting stuff and a LOT on shot string and pattern.

[orhunter]

Thanks Chuck. That's the guy.... I need to read the entire book someday.

[Jed]

Good book, worth the time.

I particularly like how he had his wife drive the car towing the billboard like target while he shot at it. Trust me honey it will be ok.

[ChuckDC]

Thanks Chuck. That's the guy.... I need to read the entire book someday.

Good news.. it's back in print with a new edition. I saw it at my local Borders'. It has a green cover now, instead of the white cover like my copy has.

[Kiger2]

Fraz,
hows the reloading going?

A couple of more thoughts. Or is correct about the effect of the shotstring. Except for very fast targets, its really not relevent. As far as the bird is concerned it is virtually standing still in relation to the shot charge.

For someone that has bristers book I thought the disadvantage of the smaller bores was that they produced longer strings compared to the 12 ga.?????

And ors comments about 7 shot having better penetration because they pick up less feathers got me thinking. I have a few pheasant hides. Im thinking about making some ballistic jell and doing some testing. 7 or 8 shot (whatever I have) at say 20 and 40 yards, versus #5 or #4 at the same ranges.20 ga with the same velocitys. Friend has a chrony, I may try and borrow it. I will find some way to wet the hides so they are more flexible and realistic and be as scientific about this as poss and check penetration. any other things to consider????

[ChuckDC]

For someone that has bristers book I thought the disadvantage of the smaller bores was that they produced longer strings compared to the 12 ga.?????

And ors comments about 7 shot having better penetration because they pick up less feathers got me thinking. I have a few pheasant hides. Im thinking about making some ballistic jell and doing some testing. 7 or 8 shot (whatever I have) at say 20 and 40 yards, versus #5 or #4 at the same ranges.20 ga with the same velocitys. Friend has a chrony, I may try and borrow it. I will find some way to wet the hides so they are more flexible and realistic and be as scientific about this as poss and check penetration. any other things to consider????

The gauge vs stringing question depends on the shot charge vs the bore size, not strictly the gauge. Brister comments that the heavier charges in 20 (like the 3" 20) string more, and so on. The idea is to stay with the shot charge that is right for the bore diameter.

If you're going to make up some ballistic gel, for comparison, remember that the temperature must be kept consistent between shots, or your results will not be terribly useful. The stuff is pretty temperature sensitive. If you want to be really particular, you can use a BBgun to fire a BB into each gel block, measure the penetration of the BB and use that to get a calibration factor. It MUST be a spring BB gun, not a pump-up one, as those are not very consistent to power level. if the BB penetration is the same, then the block is the same or really close.

[Fraz]

Fraz, hows the reloading going?

Haven't started. Waiting for my press.

[orhunter]

John:

Finally got a reply from my friend about his "hot" 28 ga load. What I got wasn't what I expected and not worth passing on. Maybe he blew up his Win. mod. 23 with the hot load and doesn't use it any more....???

[Kiger2]

ChuckDC,
Thanks for the info, Ill try and get this done next week. Ill get everything ready and do it as accurately as poss.

[Fraz]

So I'm just about to begin the adventure of reloading.
MEC Sizemaster is all set up.
Pressure seems to be a pretty serious thing. 12,500 psi is listed as the max for 28 gauge. So how is that some recipes list 13,000 psi? Seems very dangerous to me. Is pushing the 12,500 max OK?

Are the Win WAA wads interchangeable with the Claybuster 1034? If a recipe calls for WAA can I use the CB1034?

The final item I need is powder. I'm looking at recipes using Universal clays, Unique, Longshot, and Lil Gun. I've heard Longshot is not the best powder for first times. Any thoughts on any of these?

[orhunter]

John:

Never substitute a component that isn't listed in reloading data if that component doesn't result in lower pressure. No room for guesswork here. 13,000 psi isn't a lot for the 28, don't worry about it. Always stick to the slowest burning powders if pressure is a concern. It's not total pressure that we worry about as much as how quickly the pressure is achieved. Slow powders don't get into the danger zone as quickly as fast burning powders.

My Hodgdon book doesn't list very many loads with more than 3/4 oz shot, when good STS cases are used. Best load is 1300 fps w/longshot @ 1300 fps.

I use Longshot for my fast 12 ga loads so I can't understand why it is a recommended powder for 28 ga. Very strange..... Must be some really wimpy 28's out there and they are saving their neck because of these guns.... Very strange....

[Fraz]

My Hodgdon book doesn't list very many loads with more than 3/4 oz shot

I've got quite a few recipes for 7/8 oz. All use Longshot or Blue Dot.

Best load is 1300 fps w/longshot @ 1300 fps

That's plenty fast! It's all you need. I plan on loading mostly 3/4 oz. pushing 1250-1270 fps.

I use Longshot for my fast 12 ga loads so I can't understand why it is a recommended powder for 28 ga.

Seems to be widely used. It gets lots of good reviews for 28 guage performance.

I'm going to start with 20/28 Alliant. Sounds like the ticket.